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RobotDyn - Black Pill STM32, Original STM32F103C8T6 - Amazon stock Nov 28th 2020 #EQ5


LRSafari
 

First post, so I hope it is useful!

I was able to order 1 and received it last week. 2 others are backordered with stock expected the end of Nov. 
RobotDyn - Black Pill STM32
Original STM32F103C8T6 ARM Cortex-M3 128KB Min Sys Dev Board.
Pin headers NOT Soldered


I also ordered and received one of these last week. But Amazon doesn't indicate any coming in stock:
RobotDyn STM32 Black Pill Development Board
STM32F303CCT6 256 KB STM32 ARM Cortex-M4
(ST firmware, Male pin headers Not soldered)

Waiting for a kit from George to get started on this adventure! I will be (attempting) to convert a Skywatcher SkyView Pro and an Orion XT12G I am buying with a dead board. My step-up into bigger glass!


Hemendra Rawat
 

Hi, 

I'm also planning to convert my Skyview Pro EQ mount to Onstep. I'm waiting for the STM32 parts from AliExpress and RobotDyn as they're backordered. 

Did you order pulleys and belts for your Skyview Pro Eq ? If yes, which one ?

Regards,
Hemendra


On Mon, Nov 16, 2020, 2:54 PM LRSafari <lrsafari@...> wrote:
First post, so I hope it is useful!

I was able to order 1 and received it last week. 2 others are backordered with stock expected the end of Nov. 
RobotDyn - Black Pill STM32
Original STM32F103C8T6 ARM Cortex-M3 128KB Min Sys Dev Board.
Pin headers NOT Soldered


I also ordered and received one of these last week. But Amazon doesn't indicate any coming in stock:
RobotDyn STM32 Black Pill Development Board
STM32F303CCT6 256 KB STM32 ARM Cortex-M4
(ST firmware, Male pin headers Not soldered)

Waiting for a kit from George to get started on this adventure! I will be (attempting) to convert a Skywatcher SkyView Pro and an Orion XT12G I am buying with a dead board. My step-up into bigger glass!


Khalid Baheyeldin
 

On Mon, Nov 16, 2020 at 05:54 PM, LRSafari wrote:
I was able to order 1 and received it last week. 2 others are backordered with stock expected the end of Nov. 
RobotDyn - Black Pill STM32
Original STM32F103C8T6 ARM Cortex-M3 128KB Min Sys Dev Board.
Pin headers NOT Soldered
Do NOT use this module with the Blue Pill PCB!
It is not compatible, and will not work, and may even cause fires.

Here is how it looks like
https://stm32-base.org/boards/STM32F103C8T6-Black-Pill

I also ordered and received one of these last week. But Amazon doesn't indicate any coming in stock:
RobotDyn STM32 Black Pill Development Board
STM32F303CCT6 256 KB STM32 ARM Cortex-M4
(ST firmware, Male pin headers Not soldered)
The above works, and is tested. It is also much faster than the original Blue Pill.

Here is how it looks like

https://stm32-base.org/boards/STM32F303CCT6-RobotDyn-Black-Pill

We refer to it as the RobotDyn F303CC, not the Black Pill to avoid confusion.


LRSafari
 

Khalid,

Thank you! Fires are not a good sign, worse than magic smoke I am guessing! Glad I asked, and actually ordered 1 of the correct boards.

What do you think of these? I did not check the pinouts:

SongHe STM32F401 Development Board STM32F401CCU6 STM32F4 Development Board Learning Board for Arduino
SongHe STM32F401


Khalid Baheyeldin
 

On Mon, Nov 16, 2020 at 06:05 PM, LRSafari wrote:
What do you think of these? I did not check the pinouts:

SongHe STM32F401 Development Board STM32F401CCU6 STM32F4 Development Board Learning Board for Arduino

Will not work with the Blue Pill.
Only the original Blue Pill and the F303CC will work with a Blue Pill PCB.

Also, the SongHe will be approximately the same speed as the F303CC, based on other STM32F4 baords.

So no compelling reason to test and certify any other board.


Hemendra Rawat
 

Hello Khalid,

Is there a specific reason you think it can start fire ? I checked the datasheet and the pin map. It's voltage and pin compatibility  matches with the original blue pill. I'm struggling the get the STM32 parts as they are out of stock and hence wanted to try alternate options.

https://www.amazon.com/RobotDyn-STM32F103C8T6-Cortex-M3-Development-Pinheaders/dp/B07V1MV91K


Regards,
Hemendra 


Khalid Baheyeldin
 

On Mon, Nov 16, 2020 at 08:28 PM, Hemendra Rawat wrote:
Is there a specific reason you think it can start fire ? I checked the datasheet and the pin map. It's voltage and pin compatibility  matches with the original blue pill. I'm struggling the get the STM32 parts as they are out of stock and hence wanted to try alternate options.

https://www.amazon.com/RobotDyn-STM32F103C8T6-Cortex-M3-Development-Pinheaders/dp/B07V1MV91K
The one you linked to on Amazon (RobotDyn Black Pill F103) is different from the one I linked to (Black Pill F103, not RobotDyn).
The latter is the one I used 2+ years ago when I started to create the STM32 controller.
It has a different pin layout, and has 2 less pins.
The MCU is mounted as a diamond shape on the module, not as a square.
The voltage pins are in different places, so it will not work at all, and if a 3.3V or 5V pin goes into GND, it is pop/fizz.

The Amazon one is this board on STM32 Base. Note that they say 64K.
The Amazon listing says 128K in the title, but then says 64K a few lines after that!
And in the product description, they say 64K/128K/256K. Which one is it?
So beware that it may not work, and there is no guarantee that they will ship with 128K.
That is the main problem we have with the Blue Pill. They used to be all 128K, despite them being advertized as 64K.
Then a supply issue caused all of the available module to be 64K only.

Because of all of the above uncertainties, it is best to get the F303CC board, since it has 256K, and more than 2X faster.

But it is up to you ...
If you checked the pins and found that they are exactly the same, and you are able to get it as 128K, then go ahead and test it at your own risk. Report back the results.


Dave Schwartz
 

If you look at the pins on one side of the USB connector, on the original F103C8T6, there are two pins labelled GND. The PCB is designed with both of these connected to the ground plane. On the RobotDyn F103CBT6 those one of those pins has been changed to 5V. Since this 5V pin is connected to the other 5V pin (which is where the PCB feeds in the 5V) through the module, if you plug this module into the PCB, it will short the 5V to ground. This will overload the regulator which, it the best case will just shut down but in the worst case could overheat and release smoke and flame (or perhaps one can hope that the fuse will pop first).

On 2020-11-16 8:28 p.m., Hemendra Rawat wrote:
Hello Khalid,

Is there a specific reason you think it can start fire ? I checked the datasheet and the pin map. It's voltage and pin compatibility matches with the original blue pill. I'm struggling the get the STM32 parts as they are out of stock and hence wanted to try alternate options.

https://www.amazon.com/RobotDyn-STM32F103C8T6-Cortex-M3-Development-Pinheaders/dp/B07V1MV91K

Regards,
Hemendra


LRSafari
 

I pulled both of them out of their bags. They appear to have same pinouts. I bought based on the title. The description was the same for 3 versions.


Khalid Baheyeldin
 

Looking at your pictures, the GND GND beside the USB connector is reassuring that it would not cause smoke.

So it seems the F103 should work, just like the Blue Pill.

When you test it, if it does not work, it may not have 128K after all (in that case get a refund because
it is not what is on the label).

It will be less than 1/2 the speed of the F303CC though, and has half the flash storage.

Because you have the F303CC, there is no point in using the F103 at all.
Keep it as a spare or for another project.

How much did you pay for each?
And how much shipping (if any)?
How long did it take to arrive?
Which country are you in?

George, if you are reading this, you may want to take note that the F303CC can be had via Amazon.


LRSafari
 

I bought it as a spare. Or in case the 303 was difficult to get and I wanted to build a 2nd mount. 

There was only 1 of the 303 available on Amazon.com (US) And only 1 in stock of the 103. But I do have 2 of the 103 on back order till end of the month. If someone needs one (George?) yell, I can share.

103 is $8.29, free shipping/returns. Amazon says order now, in stock Nov 25th

303 was $7.86, free shipping/returns


Hemendra Rawat
 

Hello,

Can you confirm that the one available on Amazon has 128KB Flash ? If yes I would like to order one myself.

Regards,
Hemendra

On Mon, Nov 16, 2020, 6:38 PM LRSafari <lrsafari@...> wrote:
I bought it as a spare. Or in case the 303 was difficult to get and I wanted to build a 2nd mount. 

There was only 1 of the 303 available on Amazon.com (US) And only 1 in stock of the 103. But I do have 2 of the 103 on back order till end of the month. If someone needs one (George?) yell, I can share.

103 is $8.29, free shipping/returns. Amazon says order now, in stock Nov 25th

303 was $7.86, free shipping/returns


Dave Schwartz
 

Its all so confusing.

I've seen boards with F103CBT6 chips now both ways.

The vendors on eBay and AliExpress were not lying when they advertised the F103C8T6 boards with 64KB because that's all that chip was specified to have. It wasn't their fault that STM was supplying chips with the C8T6 marking with 128KB which it should have been necessary to buy the CBT6 chip to get. For some reason, ST Microelectronics was letting a lot of chips marked F103C8T6 go out the door with 128KB. There's lots of folklore has developed around that and the IDE even lists it as a board subtype. Maybe it was cheaper to do it that way with one less variation on the fab line. Maybe it was a mistake in a 10,000 or 100,000 piece run that they only caught recently. Who knows? Of course a customer (and you) have no recourse if you bought a module advertised as a C8T6 with 64KB and you actually got the happy accident of a board with one of these mislabeled 128KB chips. It wouldn't have been their fault either if you got used to a chip with more memory than it should have had (and was more than you paid for).

But those days seem to be over. There may still be some of those around but it can't be counted upon.

So when we were casting around looking for an alternative, the F103CBT6 module did come up but it (at least the one we were looking at at the time) was not pin compatible due to the change of the GND pin. Now you've found one without that change and maybe it will work fine. But I think it would be too confusing to document and would only be a temporary solution anyway...

In parallel, the OnStep code has been growing, and with the eventually-to-become-released 4.x, you're starting to have to jettison features to get it to fit in the 128KB memory at all and the problem is only going to get worse over time. Once we found the RobotDyn F303CC which has 256KB of future-proof memory, is pin-compatible and is faster, we decided to recommend that as the sole upgrade path. The fast that those are, hopefully temporarily, difficult to obtain does not change this recommendation. Yes, the F303CC is significantly more expensive than the "Blue Pill Classic" so if that or the availability turns you off there are lots of alternative OnStep platforms available to you.

On 2020-11-16 9:26 p.m., Khalid Baheyeldin wrote:
Looking at your pictures, the GND GND beside the USB connector is reassuring that it would not cause smoke.

So it seems the F103 should work, just like the Blue Pill.

When you test it, if it does not work, it may not have 128K after all (in that case get a refund because
it is not what is on the label).

It will be less than 1/2 the speed of the F303CC though, and has half the flash storage.

Because you have the F303CC, there is no point in using the F103 at all.
Keep it as a spare or for another project.

How much did you pay for each?
And how much shipping (if any)?
How long did it take to arrive?
Which country are you in?

George, if you are reading this, you may want to take note that the F303CC can be had via Amazon.


Dave Schwartz
 

Yeah, it puzzles me that the far better F303 is less expensive than the tired, old F103 on the RobotDyn site (and also that some of the F103CB product pages actually have pictures of the F303CC module).

Hopefully the price will start to come down once the cloners get into the act. For now its sole-source and they charge what they charge.

On 2020-11-16 9:38 p.m., LRSafari wrote:
I bought it as a spare. Or in case the 303 was difficult to get and I wanted to build a 2nd mount.

There was only 1 of the 303 available on Amazon.com (US) And only 1 in stock of the 103. But I do have 2 of the 103 on back order till end of the month. If someone needs one (George?) yell, I can share.

103 is $8.29, free shipping/returns. Amazon says order now, in stock Nov 25th

303 was $7.86, free shipping/returns


George Cushing
 

Just got this message from RobotDyn:
Dear Customer, Sorry the item in your order "STM32F303CCT6 256 KB Flash, STM32 ARM Cortex®-M4 Mini System Dev.board, Not Soldered" we can't to ship now because IC have defect. Kindly please open dispute to get refund. Sorry for the inconvenience.
With ST-Link v2 clones going for under $2 and the APM32F103CB also under $2, that path may be viable. 
 


Khalid Baheyeldin
 

On Mon, Nov 16, 2020 at 09:46 PM, Hemendra Rawat wrote:
Can you confirm that the one available on Amazon has 128KB Flash ? If yes I would like to order one myself.
Hemendra,

I will say this again: if you are able to buy the F303CC, then totally forget about the F103.

Again: the reasons are: the former has more flash memory, so is future proof, and is more than 2X faster.

So why do you want the F103 still?


Khalid Baheyeldin
 

On Tue, Nov 17, 2020 at 09:16 AM, George Cushing wrote:
Just got this message from RobotDyn:
Dear Customer, Sorry the item in your order "STM32F303CCT6 256 KB Flash, STM32 ARM Cortex®-M4 Mini System Dev.board, Not Soldered" we can't to ship now because IC have defect. Kindly please open dispute to get refund. Sorry for the inconvenience.
Not sure what IC defect means. Is this is a supply issue from ST, or bad batches, or what.

Regardless, can you ask them for a time estimate on when they will be available again?


 

On Tue, Nov 17, 2020 at 06:16 AM, George Cushing wrote:
Just got this message from RobotDyn:
Dear Customer, Sorry the item in your order "STM32F303CCT6 256 KB Flash, STM32 ARM Cortex®-M4 Mini System Dev.board, Not Soldered" we can't to ship now because IC have defect. Kindly please open dispute to get refund. Sorry for the inconvenience.
I placed an order with Robotdyn.com on Oct29.  Just made an inquiry to sales@..., (website address contact) only to to have my email bounce because "the address couldn't be found, or is unable to receive mail".  Makes me wonder if they're legit?  
George, was your response from that email address?


Gerry Byrne
 

My emails to Robotdyn bounced back as well today.
Gerry

On Tue 17 Nov 2020, 14:53 Richard Shagam, <rnshagam@...> wrote:
On Tue, Nov 17, 2020 at 06:16 AM, George Cushing wrote:
Just got this message from RobotDyn:
Dear Customer, Sorry the item in your order "STM32F303CCT6 256 KB Flash, STM32 ARM Cortex®-M4 Mini System Dev.board, Not Soldered" we can't to ship now because IC have defect. Kindly please open dispute to get refund. Sorry for the inconvenience.
I placed an order with Robotdyn.com on Oct29.  Just made an inquiry to sales@..., (website address contact) only to to have my email bounce because "the address couldn't be found, or is unable to receive mail".  Makes me wonder if they're legit?  
George, was your response from that email address?


--
Copernicus


Mike Ahner
 

On Tue, Nov 17, 2020 at 08:53 AM, Richard Shagam wrote:
(website address contact) only to to have my email bounce because "the address couldn't be found, or is unable to receive mail".  Makes me wonder if they're legit?
This can also mean the mailbox is full, which might happen with an excess number of replies today to that e-mail.